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-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
Van: owner-foucault@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:owner-foucault@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]Namens
PsycheCulture@xxxxxx
Verzonden: maandag 5 mei 2003 0:53
Aan: foucault@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Onderwerp: Violence, Morality and Civilization
What I am saying is that when political murder occurs, it nearly
always is infused with a sense of morality. There often is a tendency to
write about "violence" or "aggression" as if this was some sort of
"biological" tendency, or as a manifestation of some primitive form of
"evil" breaking through the veneer of civilization.
There is some sort of "breakdown" when collective violence occurs,
but what I am pointing out is that political murder occurs on the basis of
the moral imperatives of civilization.
One can observe this in the war that recently has been included. I
don't think one would wish to say that Americans "enjoyed" killing the Iraqi
people and Iraqi soldiers. Indeed (particularly with regard to the
soldiers), a strong effort has been made to HIDE THE KNOWLEDGE THAT DYING
ACTUALLY OCCURRED. If there is joy or pleasure within some Americans, it
lies in a sense of having vanquished or overcome evil.
Killing is undertaken in the name of fulfilling a RIGHTEOUS CAUSE.
Killing is "necessary" because the cause is righteous.
I disagree, phenomenologically speaking you may be right, because the
cause which is pursued in a war is per definition always 'THE RIGHT AND ONLY
ONE', but it has been said many times and confirmed by experience as well
that you actually become a true soldier after you've dehumanised the
opponent. Espacially the U.S.-soldiers were so on edge that they actually
pulled the trigger on anything that moved. Moreover you're told as a soldier
to obey orders and not to thing about them. In a war and espacially in a
postmodern war there are no human beings, anymore. This is the real killing.
The opponent is not killed, but neutralised for pure strategical purposes,
i.e. for power. The panic which overtook the U.S. after 9-11 resulted in a
virtual massmurder when Rummy made millions of human beings into devils by
placing them on the Axis of evil. Another incident of dehumanisation is the
deck of cards with the faces of Iraqi politcal leaders, the deck of cards
being sometimes referred to as the picturebook of the devil. Mind you: the
dehumanisation of opponents in the form of heathens, heretics or whitches
has a long tradition in jewish and christian history.The rest is mediamyth.
<snap>
When we don't like the leader or cause we naturally tend to focus on
the violence and aggression, the evil and cruelty of the other side. I
suggest as a general methodological principle that if we wish to understand
these processes of political mass destruction we always must look toward the
IDEAS OR BELIEFS OUT OF WHICH VIOLENCE GROWS. We label the other as "evil"
and this enables a nation to mobilize its forces to defeat the evil other.
I disagree, this is a theologisation. I think the jusitfication for the
war is strategico-utilitarian in the end. The counterarguments should have
the same stretch. Most opponents point to negative long term effects and
claim that what's best for the world is best for the U.S. I think that the
U.S. Gang of Four strongly disagrees on the latter.
However, if we wish to understand these processes of political
destructiveness, we must begin to perceive that contained within all forms
of evil is a powerful sense of goodness, that evil DERIVES FROM A SENSE OF
GOODNESS. This does not mean that all goodness leads to evil, simply that a
certain kind of PASSIONATE, INTENSE ATTACHMENT TO A CERTAIN SENSE OF THE
GOOD is the source of mass murder.
The way to hell is paved with good intentions.
Erik
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<BODY>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" color=3D#0000ff =
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<BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
size=3D2>-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----<BR><B>Van:</B>=20
owner-foucault@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx=20
[mailto:owner-foucault@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]<B>Namens=20
</B>PsycheCulture@xxxxxx<BR><B>Verzonden:</B> maandag 5 mei 2003=20
0:53<BR><B>Aan:</B> =
foucault@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<BR><B>Onderwerp:</B>=20
Violence, Morality and Civilization<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT =
size=3D2> What I am=20
saying is that when political murder occurs, it nearly always is =
<B>infused=20
with a sense of morality.</B> There often is a tendency to write about =
"violence" or "aggression" as if this was some sort of "biological" =
tendency,=20
or as a manifestation of some primitive form of "evil" breaking =
through the=20
veneer of civilization. <BR><BR> There is =
some=20
sort of "breakdown" when collective violence occurs, but what I am =
pointing=20
out is that political murder occurs </FONT><FONT size=3D2><B>on the =
basis of the=20
moral imperatives of civilization.=20
<BR><BR> </B>One can observe this in the =
war that=20
recently has been included. I don't think one would wish to say that =
Americans=20
"enjoyed" killing the Iraqi people and Iraqi soldiers. Indeed =
(particularly=20
with regard to the soldiers), a strong effort has been made to HIDE =
THE=20
KNOWLEDGE THAT DYING ACTUALLY OCCURRED. If there is joy or pleasure =
within=20
some Americans, it lies in a sense of having vanquished or overcome =
evil.=20
<BR><BR> Killing is undertaken in =
the name=20
of fulfilling a RIGHTEOUS CAUSE. Killing is "necessary" because the =
cause is=20
righteous. <SPAN class=3D793324510-05052003><FONT face=3D"Comic =
Sans MS"=20
color=3D#0000ff> </FONT></SPAN></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D793324510-05052003></SPAN></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D793324510-05052003><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" =
color=3D#0000ff>I disagree,=20
phenomenologically speaking you may be right, because the cause which =
is=20
pursued in a war is per definition always 'THE RIGHT AND =
ONLY=20
ONE', but it has been said many times and confirmed by experience =
as=20
well that you actually become a true soldier after you've=20
dehumanised the opponent. Espacially the U.S.-soldiers were so on edge =
that=20
they actually pulled the trigger on anything that moved. Moreover =
you're told=20
as a soldier to obey orders and not to thing about them. In a war and=20
espacially in a postmodern war there are no human =
beings, anymore. This=20
is the real killing. The opponent is not killed, but neutralised =
for pure=20
strategical purposes, i.e. for power. The panic which overtook =
the U.S.=20
after 9-11 resulted in a virtual massmurder when Rummy made =
millions of=20
human beings into devils by placing them on the Axis of evil. =
Another=20
incident of dehumanisation is the deck of cards with the faces of =
Iraqi=20
politcal leaders, the deck of cards being sometimes referred to as the =
picturebook of the devil. Mind you: the dehumanisation of =
opponents in=20
the form of heathens, heretics or whitches has a long tradition in =
jewish and=20
christian history.The rest is=20
mediamyth.</FONT></SPAN><BR><BR> <SPAN=20
class=3D793324510-05052003><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"=20
=
color=3D#0000ff> <snap> </FONT></SPAN><BR> &nb=
sp; When=20
we don't like the leader or cause we naturally tend to focus on the =
violence=20
and aggression, the evil and cruelty of the other side. I suggest as a =
general=20
methodological principle that if we wish to understand these processes =
of=20
political mass destruction we always must look toward the IDEAS OR =
BELIEFS OUT=20
OF WHICH VIOLENCE GROWS. We label the other as "evil" and this enables =
a=20
nation to mobilize its forces to defeat the evil other. <SPAN=20
class=3D793324510-05052003><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"=20
color=3D#0000ff> </FONT></SPAN></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D793324510-05052003><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" =
color=3D#0000ff>I disagree,=20
this is a theologisation. I think the jusitfication for the war is=20
strategico-utilitarian in the end. The counterarguments should =
have the=20
same stretch. Most opponents point to negative long term effects =
and=20
claim that what's best for the world is best for the =
U.S.</FONT> <FONT=20
face=3D"Comic Sans MS" color=3D#0000ff>I think that the U.S. Gang =
of Four=20
strongly disagrees on the=20
latter.</FONT></SPAN><BR><BR> However, if =
we wish=20
to understand these processes of political destructiveness, we must =
begin to=20
perceive that contained within all forms of evil is a powerful sense =
of=20
goodness, that evil DERIVES FROM A SENSE OF GOODNESS. This does not =
mean that=20
all goodness leads to evil, simply that a certain kind of PASSIONATE, =
INTENSE=20
ATTACHMENT TO A CERTAIN SENSE OF THE GOOD is the source of mass=20
murder. <BR><BR> <SPAN=20
class=3D793324510-05052003><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" =
color=3D#0000ff> The=20
way to hell is paved with good =
intentions.</FONT></SPAN></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D793324510-05052003></SPAN></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D793324510-05052003>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Matisse ITC" color=3D#800000 =
size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Matisse ITC" color=3D#800000=20
=
size=3D2>Erik</FONT></DIV> </SPAN></FONT></FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><=
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charset="US-ASCII"
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-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
Van: owner-foucault@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:owner-foucault@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]Namens
PsycheCulture@xxxxxx
Verzonden: maandag 5 mei 2003 0:53
Aan: foucault@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Onderwerp: Violence, Morality and Civilization
What I am saying is that when political murder occurs, it nearly
always is infused with a sense of morality. There often is a tendency to
write about "violence" or "aggression" as if this was some sort of
"biological" tendency, or as a manifestation of some primitive form of
"evil" breaking through the veneer of civilization.
There is some sort of "breakdown" when collective violence occurs,
but what I am pointing out is that political murder occurs on the basis of
the moral imperatives of civilization.
One can observe this in the war that recently has been included. I
don't think one would wish to say that Americans "enjoyed" killing the Iraqi
people and Iraqi soldiers. Indeed (particularly with regard to the
soldiers), a strong effort has been made to HIDE THE KNOWLEDGE THAT DYING
ACTUALLY OCCURRED. If there is joy or pleasure within some Americans, it
lies in a sense of having vanquished or overcome evil.
Killing is undertaken in the name of fulfilling a RIGHTEOUS CAUSE.
Killing is "necessary" because the cause is righteous.
I disagree, phenomenologically speaking you may be right, because the
cause which is pursued in a war is per definition always 'THE RIGHT AND ONLY
ONE', but it has been said many times and confirmed by experience as well
that you actually become a true soldier after you've dehumanised the
opponent. Espacially the U.S.-soldiers were so on edge that they actually
pulled the trigger on anything that moved. Moreover you're told as a soldier
to obey orders and not to thing about them. In a war and espacially in a
postmodern war there are no human beings, anymore. This is the real killing.
The opponent is not killed, but neutralised for pure strategical purposes,
i.e. for power. The panic which overtook the U.S. after 9-11 resulted in a
virtual massmurder when Rummy made millions of human beings into devils by
placing them on the Axis of evil. Another incident of dehumanisation is the
deck of cards with the faces of Iraqi politcal leaders, the deck of cards
being sometimes referred to as the picturebook of the devil. Mind you: the
dehumanisation of opponents in the form of heathens, heretics or whitches
has a long tradition in jewish and christian history.The rest is mediamyth.
<snap>
When we don't like the leader or cause we naturally tend to focus on
the violence and aggression, the evil and cruelty of the other side. I
suggest as a general methodological principle that if we wish to understand
these processes of political mass destruction we always must look toward the
IDEAS OR BELIEFS OUT OF WHICH VIOLENCE GROWS. We label the other as "evil"
and this enables a nation to mobilize its forces to defeat the evil other.
I disagree, this is a theologisation. I think the jusitfication for the
war is strategico-utilitarian in the end. The counterarguments should have
the same stretch. Most opponents point to negative long term effects and
claim that what's best for the world is best for the U.S. I think that the
U.S. Gang of Four strongly disagrees on the latter.
However, if we wish to understand these processes of political
destructiveness, we must begin to perceive that contained within all forms
of evil is a powerful sense of goodness, that evil DERIVES FROM A SENSE OF
GOODNESS. This does not mean that all goodness leads to evil, simply that a
certain kind of PASSIONATE, INTENSE ATTACHMENT TO A CERTAIN SENSE OF THE
GOOD is the source of mass murder.
The way to hell is paved with good intentions.
Erik
------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C31306.FF4D66A0
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dus-ascii">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2600.0" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
size=3D2>-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----<BR><B>Van:</B>=20
owner-foucault@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx=20
[mailto:owner-foucault@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]<B>Namens=20
</B>PsycheCulture@xxxxxx<BR><B>Verzonden:</B> maandag 5 mei 2003=20
0:53<BR><B>Aan:</B> =
foucault@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<BR><B>Onderwerp:</B>=20
Violence, Morality and Civilization<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT =
size=3D2> What I am=20
saying is that when political murder occurs, it nearly always is =
<B>infused=20
with a sense of morality.</B> There often is a tendency to write about =
"violence" or "aggression" as if this was some sort of "biological" =
tendency,=20
or as a manifestation of some primitive form of "evil" breaking =
through the=20
veneer of civilization. <BR><BR> There is =
some=20
sort of "breakdown" when collective violence occurs, but what I am =
pointing=20
out is that political murder occurs </FONT><FONT size=3D2><B>on the =
basis of the=20
moral imperatives of civilization.=20
<BR><BR> </B>One can observe this in the =
war that=20
recently has been included. I don't think one would wish to say that =
Americans=20
"enjoyed" killing the Iraqi people and Iraqi soldiers. Indeed =
(particularly=20
with regard to the soldiers), a strong effort has been made to HIDE =
THE=20
KNOWLEDGE THAT DYING ACTUALLY OCCURRED. If there is joy or pleasure =
within=20
some Americans, it lies in a sense of having vanquished or overcome =
evil.=20
<BR><BR> Killing is undertaken in =
the name=20
of fulfilling a RIGHTEOUS CAUSE. Killing is "necessary" because the =
cause is=20
righteous. <SPAN class=3D793324510-05052003><FONT face=3D"Comic =
Sans MS"=20
color=3D#0000ff> </FONT></SPAN></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D793324510-05052003></SPAN></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D793324510-05052003><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" =
color=3D#0000ff>I disagree,=20
phenomenologically speaking you may be right, because the cause which =
is=20
pursued in a war is per definition always 'THE RIGHT AND =
ONLY=20
ONE', but it has been said many times and confirmed by experience =
as=20
well that you actually become a true soldier after you've=20
dehumanised the opponent. Espacially the U.S.-soldiers were so on edge =
that=20
they actually pulled the trigger on anything that moved. Moreover =
you're told=20
as a soldier to obey orders and not to thing about them. In a war and=20
espacially in a postmodern war there are no human =
beings, anymore. This=20
is the real killing. The opponent is not killed, but neutralised =
for pure=20
strategical purposes, i.e. for power. The panic which overtook =
the U.S.=20
after 9-11 resulted in a virtual massmurder when Rummy made =
millions of=20
human beings into devils by placing them on the Axis of evil. =
Another=20
incident of dehumanisation is the deck of cards with the faces of =
Iraqi=20
politcal leaders, the deck of cards being sometimes referred to as the =
picturebook of the devil. Mind you: the dehumanisation of =
opponents in=20
the form of heathens, heretics or whitches has a long tradition in =
jewish and=20
christian history.The rest is=20
mediamyth.</FONT></SPAN><BR><BR> <SPAN=20
class=3D793324510-05052003><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"=20
=
color=3D#0000ff> <snap> </FONT></SPAN><BR> &nb=
sp; When=20
we don't like the leader or cause we naturally tend to focus on the =
violence=20
and aggression, the evil and cruelty of the other side. I suggest as a =
general=20
methodological principle that if we wish to understand these processes =
of=20
political mass destruction we always must look toward the IDEAS OR =
BELIEFS OUT=20
OF WHICH VIOLENCE GROWS. We label the other as "evil" and this enables =
a=20
nation to mobilize its forces to defeat the evil other. <SPAN=20
class=3D793324510-05052003><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"=20
color=3D#0000ff> </FONT></SPAN></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D793324510-05052003><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" =
color=3D#0000ff>I disagree,=20
this is a theologisation. I think the jusitfication for the war is=20
strategico-utilitarian in the end. The counterarguments should =
have the=20
same stretch. Most opponents point to negative long term effects =
and=20
claim that what's best for the world is best for the =
U.S.</FONT> <FONT=20
face=3D"Comic Sans MS" color=3D#0000ff>I think that the U.S. Gang =
of Four=20
strongly disagrees on the=20
latter.</FONT></SPAN><BR><BR> However, if =
we wish=20
to understand these processes of political destructiveness, we must =
begin to=20
perceive that contained within all forms of evil is a powerful sense =
of=20
goodness, that evil DERIVES FROM A SENSE OF GOODNESS. This does not =
mean that=20
all goodness leads to evil, simply that a certain kind of PASSIONATE, =
INTENSE=20
ATTACHMENT TO A CERTAIN SENSE OF THE GOOD is the source of mass=20
murder. <BR><BR> <SPAN=20
class=3D793324510-05052003><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" =
color=3D#0000ff> The=20
way to hell is paved with good =
intentions.</FONT></SPAN></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D793324510-05052003></SPAN></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D793324510-05052003>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Matisse ITC" color=3D#800000 =
size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Matisse ITC" color=3D#800000=20
=
size=3D2>Erik</FONT></DIV> </SPAN></FONT></FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><=
/BODY></HTML>
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