On Thu, 22 May 1997, COLIN WIGHT wrote:
> As a non-silent participant (although what i haven't said - the silences -
> may have been more coherent) I suppose I should say something. All the stuff
> on surveillance and panopticism (look at Discipline and Punish) would seem
> to be relevant, but it seems to me you might want to also look at Spivak on
> this also, especially 'Can the Subaltern Speak?'. Also, if I remember
> rightly, the discussion betwteen Foucault and assembled others called the
> 'confession of the flesh' does touch, very briefly, on the subject of
> silence. (its in Power/Knowledge, Colin Gordon (ed.)
>
> Obviously, silence is an ambigous notion. But I am not sure (and i am not
> trying to pick a fight here) John's example really constitutes a victory for
> the heroine, and even if it is it seems an, at best, ironic one. Suicide, i
> presume, would have achieved the same result.
>
> I suppose we can redescribe every defeat as a victory of sorts: the
> condemned man/woman commits suicide and cheats the system of its revenge;
> the army was not defeated it simply asserted it right not to fight any
> longer, and in so doing denied the opposing army of its wish for a battle;
> The tortured man/woman asserts their right not to talk and gets beaten to
> death; I go silently into the night because.....
>
> Thanks
I'm not trying to pick a fight either but just to comment: Not every
suicide, not every defeat or retreat can be read as a "victory." But
*some* can. I'm drawing a blank right now but there's that film starring
Geena Davis and another woman and at the end they drive off the cliff
rather than allow themselves to be captured.
Compare that to the Heaven's Gate suicides.
--John
> As a non-silent participant (although what i haven't said - the silences -
> may have been more coherent) I suppose I should say something. All the stuff
> on surveillance and panopticism (look at Discipline and Punish) would seem
> to be relevant, but it seems to me you might want to also look at Spivak on
> this also, especially 'Can the Subaltern Speak?'. Also, if I remember
> rightly, the discussion betwteen Foucault and assembled others called the
> 'confession of the flesh' does touch, very briefly, on the subject of
> silence. (its in Power/Knowledge, Colin Gordon (ed.)
>
> Obviously, silence is an ambigous notion. But I am not sure (and i am not
> trying to pick a fight here) John's example really constitutes a victory for
> the heroine, and even if it is it seems an, at best, ironic one. Suicide, i
> presume, would have achieved the same result.
>
> I suppose we can redescribe every defeat as a victory of sorts: the
> condemned man/woman commits suicide and cheats the system of its revenge;
> the army was not defeated it simply asserted it right not to fight any
> longer, and in so doing denied the opposing army of its wish for a battle;
> The tortured man/woman asserts their right not to talk and gets beaten to
> death; I go silently into the night because.....
>
> Thanks
I'm not trying to pick a fight either but just to comment: Not every
suicide, not every defeat or retreat can be read as a "victory." But
*some* can. I'm drawing a blank right now but there's that film starring
Geena Davis and another woman and at the end they drive off the cliff
rather than allow themselves to be captured.
Compare that to the Heaven's Gate suicides.
--John