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Hi Dan,
Hello Adam, your comments prompt two questions:
First, aren't all power relations asymmetrical (esp. within F.'s=20
'neo-Nietzschean' conception)?
Asymmetrical is perhaps a bit of a nebulous term, but I think it's the =
term Foucault uses for domination. He gives the example of the female =
position as being in an asymmetrical arrangement in the Victorian family =
as an example somewhere. She would have had recourse to small acts of =
deviance but these would be very limited. In other words she was in a =
position with no room for meaningful resistance. I'm not an expert on =
Nietzsche, but I believe he had a view about the subject position that =
influenced Foucault and saw acts of deviance as a way of overcoming =
subjectivity. Giving in to the animal forces or something. I think this =
is something Foucault practised personally through s&m (limit =
experiences). These things are perhaps slightly different, I'm not sure. =
Foucault said in one of his latter interviews that he wanted to show =
people that they have more freedom than they imagine. This is a =
surprising thing to say when you consider that he charted the growth of =
serious statements, bio power, dividing practice, governmentality etc. =
etc. What I think he means is that there was never a golden age when =
people were free. Although in ancient Greece certain classes seemed to =
have recourse to techniques of the self that weren't as limited as they =
are perhaps today. Man then had not become subject and object of his own =
knowledge, which seems to be dangerous when you consider what it led to. =
But despite this it seems impossible for man to exist outside of power =
relationships, it's the natural environment for his existence. It's like =
asking a fish to swim out of water. This is why utopia is elusive. It is =
impossible to practise acts of freedom if you're free. The important =
thing is the practise rather than the goal that you never reach. Freedom =
is simply a practise not a state and it requires something to battle =
against and the ability to battle. =20
Second, why would asymmetrical=20
power relations preclude resistance?
Because they're not power relationships but an arrangement of =
domination. There is a prisoner in America who is kept in a cage and has =
24 hour a day surveillance. He isn't allowed a razor even and looks like =
a caveman. He is therefore not in a position to resist, his only act of =
resistance left would be to probably kill himself. Such a relation can't =
really be productive there is no reciprocity. If power is a practise =
there must be reciprocity as no one can possess power as such.=20
Sorry if I've misunderstood your comments.
I'm grateful to discuss these issues and hope I've clarified my =
understanding. which is of course open to contradiction. Foucault is a =
master of truth games and puzzles. I sometimes change my opinions =
regarding his work on a daily basis. He often consciously contradicts =
himself which makes me think Miller's thesis is quite convincing, though =
not the whole truth, which of course doesn't exist. Foucault's work is =
fiction in a sense, as he said. And he liked to laugh at people trying =
to decipher what he meant.
Cheers,
Adam=20
------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C06C65.9975BA20
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<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
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<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2722.2800" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: =
0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT color=3D#ff0000>Hi =
Dan,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"> </DIV>
<DIV>Hello Adam, your comments prompt two questions:<BR><BR>First, =
aren't all=20
power relations asymmetrical (esp. within F.'s <BR>'neo-Nietzschean'=20
conception)?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#ff0000 face=3DArial size=3D2>Asymmetrical is =
perhaps a bit of a=20
nebulous term, but I think it's the term Foucault uses for domination. =
He=20
gives the example of the female position as being in an asymmetrical=20
arrangement in the Victorian family as an example somewhere. She would =
have=20
had recourse to small acts of deviance but these would be very =
limited. =20
In other words she was in a position with no room for meaningful =
resistance.=20
I'm not an expert on Nietzsche, but I believe he had a view about the =
subject=20
position that influenced Foucault and saw acts of deviance as a way of =
overcoming subjectivity. Giving in to the animal forces or something. =
I think=20
this is something Foucault practised personally through s&m (limit =
experiences). These things are perhaps slightly different, I'm not =
sure.=20
Foucault said in one of his latter interviews that he wanted to show =
people=20
that they have more freedom than they imagine. This is a surprising =
thing to=20
say when you consider that he charted the growth of serious =
statements, bio=20
power, dividing practice, governmentality etc. etc. What I think he =
means is=20
that there was never a golden age when people were free. Although in =
ancient=20
Greece certain classes seemed to have recourse to techniques of the =
self that=20
weren't as limited as they are perhaps today. Man then had not become =
subject=20
and object of his own knowledge, which seems to be dangerous when you =
consider=20
what it led to. But despite this it seems impossible for man to exist =
outside=20
of power relationships, it's the natural environment for his =
existence. It's=20
like asking a fish to swim out of water. This is why utopia is =
elusive. It is=20
impossible to practise acts of freedom if you're free. The important =
thing is=20
the practise rather than the goal that you never reach. Freedom is =
simply a=20
practise not a state and it requires something to battle against and =
the=20
ability to battle. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> Second, why would asymmetrical <BR>power relations preclude =
resistance?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#ff0000 face=3DArial size=3D2>Because they're not =
power=20
relationships but an arrangement of domination. There is a prisoner in =
America=20
who is kept in a cage and has 24 hour a day surveillance. He isn't =
allowed a=20
razor even and looks like a caveman. He is therefore not in a position =
to=20
resist, his only act of resistance left would be to probably kill =
himself.=20
Such a relation can't really be productive there is no reciprocity. If =
power=20
is a practise there must be reciprocity as no one can possess power as =
such.=20
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><BR><BR>Sorry if I've misunderstood your comments.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#ff0000 face=3DArial size=3D2>I'm grateful to =
discuss these=20
issues and hope I've clarified my understanding. which is of course =
open to=20
contradiction. Foucault is a master of truth games and puzzles. I =
sometimes change my opinions regarding his work on a daily basis. He =
often=20
consciously contradicts himself which makes me think Miller's thesis =
is quite=20
convincing, though not the whole truth, which of course doesn't exist. =
Foucault's work is fiction in a sense, as he said. And he liked =
to laugh=20
at people trying to decipher what he meant.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#ff0000 face=3DArial size=3D2>Cheers,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#ff0000 face=3DArial size=3D2>Adam=20
</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
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------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C06C65.9975BA20
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
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Hi Dan,
Hello Adam, your comments prompt two questions:
First, aren't all power relations asymmetrical (esp. within F.'s=20
'neo-Nietzschean' conception)?
Asymmetrical is perhaps a bit of a nebulous term, but I think it's the =
term Foucault uses for domination. He gives the example of the female =
position as being in an asymmetrical arrangement in the Victorian family =
as an example somewhere. She would have had recourse to small acts of =
deviance but these would be very limited. In other words she was in a =
position with no room for meaningful resistance. I'm not an expert on =
Nietzsche, but I believe he had a view about the subject position that =
influenced Foucault and saw acts of deviance as a way of overcoming =
subjectivity. Giving in to the animal forces or something. I think this =
is something Foucault practised personally through s&m (limit =
experiences). These things are perhaps slightly different, I'm not sure. =
Foucault said in one of his latter interviews that he wanted to show =
people that they have more freedom than they imagine. This is a =
surprising thing to say when you consider that he charted the growth of =
serious statements, bio power, dividing practice, governmentality etc. =
etc. What I think he means is that there was never a golden age when =
people were free. Although in ancient Greece certain classes seemed to =
have recourse to techniques of the self that weren't as limited as they =
are perhaps today. Man then had not become subject and object of his own =
knowledge, which seems to be dangerous when you consider what it led to. =
But despite this it seems impossible for man to exist outside of power =
relationships, it's the natural environment for his existence. It's like =
asking a fish to swim out of water. This is why utopia is elusive. It is =
impossible to practise acts of freedom if you're free. The important =
thing is the practise rather than the goal that you never reach. Freedom =
is simply a practise not a state and it requires something to battle =
against and the ability to battle. =20
Second, why would asymmetrical=20
power relations preclude resistance?
Because they're not power relationships but an arrangement of =
domination. There is a prisoner in America who is kept in a cage and has =
24 hour a day surveillance. He isn't allowed a razor even and looks like =
a caveman. He is therefore not in a position to resist, his only act of =
resistance left would be to probably kill himself. Such a relation can't =
really be productive there is no reciprocity. If power is a practise =
there must be reciprocity as no one can possess power as such.=20
Sorry if I've misunderstood your comments.
I'm grateful to discuss these issues and hope I've clarified my =
understanding. which is of course open to contradiction. Foucault is a =
master of truth games and puzzles. I sometimes change my opinions =
regarding his work on a daily basis. He often consciously contradicts =
himself which makes me think Miller's thesis is quite convincing, though =
not the whole truth, which of course doesn't exist. Foucault's work is =
fiction in a sense, as he said. And he liked to laugh at people trying =
to decipher what he meant.
Cheers,
Adam=20
------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C06C65.9975BA20
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2722.2800" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: =
0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT color=3D#ff0000>Hi =
Dan,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"> </DIV>
<DIV>Hello Adam, your comments prompt two questions:<BR><BR>First, =
aren't all=20
power relations asymmetrical (esp. within F.'s <BR>'neo-Nietzschean'=20
conception)?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#ff0000 face=3DArial size=3D2>Asymmetrical is =
perhaps a bit of a=20
nebulous term, but I think it's the term Foucault uses for domination. =
He=20
gives the example of the female position as being in an asymmetrical=20
arrangement in the Victorian family as an example somewhere. She would =
have=20
had recourse to small acts of deviance but these would be very =
limited. =20
In other words she was in a position with no room for meaningful =
resistance.=20
I'm not an expert on Nietzsche, but I believe he had a view about the =
subject=20
position that influenced Foucault and saw acts of deviance as a way of =
overcoming subjectivity. Giving in to the animal forces or something. =
I think=20
this is something Foucault practised personally through s&m (limit =
experiences). These things are perhaps slightly different, I'm not =
sure.=20
Foucault said in one of his latter interviews that he wanted to show =
people=20
that they have more freedom than they imagine. This is a surprising =
thing to=20
say when you consider that he charted the growth of serious =
statements, bio=20
power, dividing practice, governmentality etc. etc. What I think he =
means is=20
that there was never a golden age when people were free. Although in =
ancient=20
Greece certain classes seemed to have recourse to techniques of the =
self that=20
weren't as limited as they are perhaps today. Man then had not become =
subject=20
and object of his own knowledge, which seems to be dangerous when you =
consider=20
what it led to. But despite this it seems impossible for man to exist =
outside=20
of power relationships, it's the natural environment for his =
existence. It's=20
like asking a fish to swim out of water. This is why utopia is =
elusive. It is=20
impossible to practise acts of freedom if you're free. The important =
thing is=20
the practise rather than the goal that you never reach. Freedom is =
simply a=20
practise not a state and it requires something to battle against and =
the=20
ability to battle. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> Second, why would asymmetrical <BR>power relations preclude =
resistance?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#ff0000 face=3DArial size=3D2>Because they're not =
power=20
relationships but an arrangement of domination. There is a prisoner in =
America=20
who is kept in a cage and has 24 hour a day surveillance. He isn't =
allowed a=20
razor even and looks like a caveman. He is therefore not in a position =
to=20
resist, his only act of resistance left would be to probably kill =
himself.=20
Such a relation can't really be productive there is no reciprocity. If =
power=20
is a practise there must be reciprocity as no one can possess power as =
such.=20
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><BR><BR>Sorry if I've misunderstood your comments.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#ff0000 face=3DArial size=3D2>I'm grateful to =
discuss these=20
issues and hope I've clarified my understanding. which is of course =
open to=20
contradiction. Foucault is a master of truth games and puzzles. I =
sometimes change my opinions regarding his work on a daily basis. He =
often=20
consciously contradicts himself which makes me think Miller's thesis =
is quite=20
convincing, though not the whole truth, which of course doesn't exist. =
Foucault's work is fiction in a sense, as he said. And he liked =
to laugh=20
at people trying to decipher what he meant.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#ff0000 face=3DArial size=3D2>Cheers,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#ff0000 face=3DArial size=3D2>Adam=20
</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C06C65.9975BA20--