Sorry, J. Patrick, i ve pasted the post of a
discussion that i am having in d&g forum,,, I
cross-posted the message... My question refers about
what effect has drugs had on the thought
of foucault, delezue, and guattari? i was not too
difficult to guess, was it?
Well, what can you commnet about this?
Besides, i do really need that D´s note, in english or
spanish... Can you help?
adr
--- John Patrick <panoptician@xxxxxxxxxxx> escribió:
> "Could anyone share a english or spanish traslations
> of deleuzes note 'What
> they would think about us?'"
>
> Iz that the only qwestion?
>
>
>
> >From: nairda oremor <oxanairda@xxxxxxxxx>
> >Reply-To: foucault@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >To: foucault@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >Subject: Re: politics of experience: no where to
> run!!
> >Date: Thu, 1 Aug 2002 21:37:55 -0500 (CDT)
> >
> >Dear all,
> >
> >Yes, my question certainly refers to the effect
> that
> >drugs have on the thought of these thinkers, but
> even
> >more, it refers about which kind of drugs they used
> to
> >use not as a merely way of life, but a way of
> thinking
> >and producing their particular thought. Foucault
> >brings me a lot of doubts on this matter: when I
> read
> >Le mots et les choses I realized that the
> historical
> >retrospective through the classic epoch concerning
> to
> >the arqueologycal method is a point of view that
> could
> >vanish some estructurated enunciations or
> cathegorical
> >implications, in order to find positive knowledge
> >beyond historical insterstices. All through that
> book,
> >this positionated view remains to a fenomenologycal
> >approach that sounds very lysergic to me (this
> could
> >be a potential trap, as you say, that we can never
> get
> >rid of it) but the controversial book could never
> >reach that pretended point of view, without a
> >desterritorializazed proposal (concerning to
> >epistemology history or philosophy) that Foucault
> >might fill in with his own thinking... It is well
> know
> >that after that his was worried about that
> >unpredictable effect, and a few months later he
> wrote
> >Larcheology du savoir as a response of the
> >methological debt... We could not forget that by
> that
> >time Le mots et les choses was a combat book, that
> >detonated a rupture inside the academic
> circuits...it
> >shined as a response of its epoch as well: the
> >sixties, a decade of highly psyquedelic tolerance
> >(fisiologycally speaking)... besides, french young
> >philosophers or french intellectuals were very
> >discrete about their use of drugs, it was not
> mererly
> >the case of the american ones, that were very
> >extroverted about political implicances concerning
> to
> >psyquedelic tolerance and its consequent opened
> minded
> >ideologies, or even the collective possibility of a
> >lucid political conscience...
> >
> >After the effervecence of that, a few years after
> >(surerly the shortest years of the century)
> Foucault
> >wrote Thetrum Philosophicum, with the profound
> feeling
> >of let going some young and intense way of living
> and
> >thinking (his pilgrimage from arqueology to
> >genealogy). His comment about LSD and opium might
> let
> >us interpretate that he used to use this drugs
> >(homesickness about the huge wave of his epoch, a
> >bye-bye of its own epistemical context, a grave to
> the
> >fenomenologycal domain) so, we could follow an
> >overcoded interpretation: using Lsd could bring on
> to
> >him the arqueologycal point of view (the one that
> >finally collapses the fenomenologycal approach and
> >vanishes the estructurated cathegories) and in the
> >other hand, using opium might bring on to his work
> the
> >genealogical implicance (the one that configurates
> >power and its substancialization, the one that
> could
> >let him walk into the categorical indifference
> >unharmed, what is it to say, the one that reveals
> >somekind of trangresive transgression. (So, as you
> can
> >notice: I am interested in tracing transversal
> >associations betweem the man, the drug, and his
> >work...) This intellectual curtain might suit on
> D&Gs
> >work: we could think that they had never used a
> drug
> >and they were some human mediums that could abduce
> >empirical wisdom from the otherness, or we could
> think
> >that their way of thinking was actually a product
> of
> >an ionically empirical certitude orientated by the
> use
> >of some drugs.
> >
> >I just cannot believe what they say in ATP (not
> >applied to them, of course) That suggestions
> couldnot
> >inmediatly significate that the use of some drugs
> >(but, which one?) was erradicated off their
> thought.
> >That comment was surerly avoiding the fact that
> their
> >thought could promote the use of some drugs?doesnot
> >lead us to think that they were flipping out with
> >water (instead of that, may suggest that they were
> far
> >beyond the drug experience?.) if it does exist a
> >letter to a harsh critic it was as a response to
> set
> >up the intellectual curtain?
> >
> >Pd (to every one on the list) Could anyone share a
> >english or spanish traslations of deleuzes note
> "What
> >they would think about us?"
> >
> >adr
> >
> > --- nairda oremor <oxanairda@xxxxxxxxx> escribi:
> >
> >Hi everyone on the list!!!
> > >
> > > I have been writting about the use of some drugs
> > > related to the work of contemporary thinkers:
> > > philosofers, antropologysts, psycologists and
> > > psyquiatrists... The main argument concerns to
> make
> > > visible and hopefully follow the discourse that
> make
> > > posible the so called "politics of
> experience"...
> > > Anyway, could someone on this list afirm that
> > > Deleuze,
> > > Foucault or Guattari never used drugs? It is
> well
> > > known that the famous note "Que se va a pensar
> de
> > > nosotros?" (the translation in English could be
> > > "What
> > > they would think about us") respond to this
> > > implications... but, Is there any chance to
> hesitate
> > > about this? We know that Foucault liked opium
> and in
> > > some way he also admited some LSD
> experiences...:(by
> > > that time, Foucault was living a passage between
> the
> > > arqueology and genealogy between the knowledge
> and
> > > power... it makes me think that this passage
> > > represents some dark crisis that could be linked
> to
> > > the transition of a mererly arquelogical use of
> Lsd
> > > to
> > > a deeply genealogical use of opium... Yes, that
> > > hooked
> > > Foucault was the one that substancialized powern
> > > order
> > > to fight it, but underneath the implication of
> > > thinking through out the indiference of dope
> -and
> > > any
> > > later the third Foucault, Foucault the Greek,
> > > Foucault
> > > worried about the selfcare-)...
> > >
> > > In the other hand, i dont have any reference to
> link
> > >
> > > Deleuze or Guattaris work to the use of any
> drug...
> > > this makes me think that is simply imposible to
> > > imagine them in soberland... Somehow this must
> lead
> > > to
> > > the cultural fight that consagrates political
>
=== message truncated ===
_________________________________________________________
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discussion that i am having in d&g forum,,, I
cross-posted the message... My question refers about
what effect has drugs had on the thought
of foucault, delezue, and guattari? i was not too
difficult to guess, was it?
Well, what can you commnet about this?
Besides, i do really need that D´s note, in english or
spanish... Can you help?
adr
--- John Patrick <panoptician@xxxxxxxxxxx> escribió:
> "Could anyone share a english or spanish traslations
> of deleuzes note 'What
> they would think about us?'"
>
> Iz that the only qwestion?
>
>
>
> >From: nairda oremor <oxanairda@xxxxxxxxx>
> >Reply-To: foucault@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >To: foucault@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >Subject: Re: politics of experience: no where to
> run!!
> >Date: Thu, 1 Aug 2002 21:37:55 -0500 (CDT)
> >
> >Dear all,
> >
> >Yes, my question certainly refers to the effect
> that
> >drugs have on the thought of these thinkers, but
> even
> >more, it refers about which kind of drugs they used
> to
> >use not as a merely way of life, but a way of
> thinking
> >and producing their particular thought. Foucault
> >brings me a lot of doubts on this matter: when I
> read
> >Le mots et les choses I realized that the
> historical
> >retrospective through the classic epoch concerning
> to
> >the arqueologycal method is a point of view that
> could
> >vanish some estructurated enunciations or
> cathegorical
> >implications, in order to find positive knowledge
> >beyond historical insterstices. All through that
> book,
> >this positionated view remains to a fenomenologycal
> >approach that sounds very lysergic to me (this
> could
> >be a potential trap, as you say, that we can never
> get
> >rid of it) but the controversial book could never
> >reach that pretended point of view, without a
> >desterritorializazed proposal (concerning to
> >epistemology history or philosophy) that Foucault
> >might fill in with his own thinking... It is well
> know
> >that after that his was worried about that
> >unpredictable effect, and a few months later he
> wrote
> >Larcheology du savoir as a response of the
> >methological debt... We could not forget that by
> that
> >time Le mots et les choses was a combat book, that
> >detonated a rupture inside the academic
> circuits...it
> >shined as a response of its epoch as well: the
> >sixties, a decade of highly psyquedelic tolerance
> >(fisiologycally speaking)... besides, french young
> >philosophers or french intellectuals were very
> >discrete about their use of drugs, it was not
> mererly
> >the case of the american ones, that were very
> >extroverted about political implicances concerning
> to
> >psyquedelic tolerance and its consequent opened
> minded
> >ideologies, or even the collective possibility of a
> >lucid political conscience...
> >
> >After the effervecence of that, a few years after
> >(surerly the shortest years of the century)
> Foucault
> >wrote Thetrum Philosophicum, with the profound
> feeling
> >of let going some young and intense way of living
> and
> >thinking (his pilgrimage from arqueology to
> >genealogy). His comment about LSD and opium might
> let
> >us interpretate that he used to use this drugs
> >(homesickness about the huge wave of his epoch, a
> >bye-bye of its own epistemical context, a grave to
> the
> >fenomenologycal domain) so, we could follow an
> >overcoded interpretation: using Lsd could bring on
> to
> >him the arqueologycal point of view (the one that
> >finally collapses the fenomenologycal approach and
> >vanishes the estructurated cathegories) and in the
> >other hand, using opium might bring on to his work
> the
> >genealogical implicance (the one that configurates
> >power and its substancialization, the one that
> could
> >let him walk into the categorical indifference
> >unharmed, what is it to say, the one that reveals
> >somekind of trangresive transgression. (So, as you
> can
> >notice: I am interested in tracing transversal
> >associations betweem the man, the drug, and his
> >work...) This intellectual curtain might suit on
> D&Gs
> >work: we could think that they had never used a
> drug
> >and they were some human mediums that could abduce
> >empirical wisdom from the otherness, or we could
> think
> >that their way of thinking was actually a product
> of
> >an ionically empirical certitude orientated by the
> use
> >of some drugs.
> >
> >I just cannot believe what they say in ATP (not
> >applied to them, of course) That suggestions
> couldnot
> >inmediatly significate that the use of some drugs
> >(but, which one?) was erradicated off their
> thought.
> >That comment was surerly avoiding the fact that
> their
> >thought could promote the use of some drugs?doesnot
> >lead us to think that they were flipping out with
> >water (instead of that, may suggest that they were
> far
> >beyond the drug experience?.) if it does exist a
> >letter to a harsh critic it was as a response to
> set
> >up the intellectual curtain?
> >
> >Pd (to every one on the list) Could anyone share a
> >english or spanish traslations of deleuzes note
> "What
> >they would think about us?"
> >
> >adr
> >
> > --- nairda oremor <oxanairda@xxxxxxxxx> escribi:
> >
> >Hi everyone on the list!!!
> > >
> > > I have been writting about the use of some drugs
> > > related to the work of contemporary thinkers:
> > > philosofers, antropologysts, psycologists and
> > > psyquiatrists... The main argument concerns to
> make
> > > visible and hopefully follow the discourse that
> make
> > > posible the so called "politics of
> experience"...
> > > Anyway, could someone on this list afirm that
> > > Deleuze,
> > > Foucault or Guattari never used drugs? It is
> well
> > > known that the famous note "Que se va a pensar
> de
> > > nosotros?" (the translation in English could be
> > > "What
> > > they would think about us") respond to this
> > > implications... but, Is there any chance to
> hesitate
> > > about this? We know that Foucault liked opium
> and in
> > > some way he also admited some LSD
> experiences...:(by
> > > that time, Foucault was living a passage between
> the
> > > arqueology and genealogy between the knowledge
> and
> > > power... it makes me think that this passage
> > > represents some dark crisis that could be linked
> to
> > > the transition of a mererly arquelogical use of
> Lsd
> > > to
> > > a deeply genealogical use of opium... Yes, that
> > > hooked
> > > Foucault was the one that substancialized powern
> > > order
> > > to fight it, but underneath the implication of
> > > thinking through out the indiference of dope
> -and
> > > any
> > > later the third Foucault, Foucault the Greek,
> > > Foucault
> > > worried about the selfcare-)...
> > >
> > > In the other hand, i dont have any reference to
> link
> > >
> > > Deleuze or Guattaris work to the use of any
> drug...
> > > this makes me think that is simply imposible to
> > > imagine them in soberland... Somehow this must
> lead
> > > to
> > > the cultural fight that consagrates political
>
=== message truncated ===
_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Información de Estados Unidos y América Latina, en Yahoo! Noticias.
Visítanos en http://noticias.espanol.yahoo.com